which software bim?

[ChiccoG]

Good morning to all,
Given the times of forced labour slowing down, we talked, with a colleague, about the opportunity to approach bim design, evaluating the purchase of suitable software (civil design of buildings mostly).
I support the opportunity to fully understand, first of all, (and to be able to understand which software is best suited to our needs), what is really meant by bim design, what are the criteria, the standards provided and especially what are the characteristics that make a software able to interface with others (and therefore to be able to communicate my project with that of another professional, in order to build together a single integrated model).
On the other hand, the colleague argues, instead, that if you do not expect to face particularly complex projects (as in our case), you should rely on an Italian software house, so be sure that the software meets the requirements required by current and future Italian legislation.
in a previous discussion, someone told someone else to "note in your blue or hot "pozzangherina", I would like to understand if there is a background of truth and in what terms you have to understand this phrase. buying one of these software would I have problems in interface with other professionals using different software?
thanks to all for the answer, and apologize in advance if inaccuracies were written, due to my complete extraneity to this world. greetings

 

[gibi]

Hello, Chiccog.

I press that I have no answers to your question, since I deal with other (infrastructures).
but I think your post is very clear and concrete, unlike many (too many) things that feel.
I think you're lucky because the building/architecture is more mature.
"lucky" between quotes, why, as you centered: does it make sense to entrust me to one of the usual big names/software house for less large projects (and therefore less paid)?
It's already been a month and a half that, with the covid emergency, has only aggravated these aspects.
and I see you haven't received any answers.
Two things, on which I would ask everyone to realize:

1. how to have a tool that interferes effectively?
   1. What are the software to interface with? structures, plants, display 3d/presentation, finishing boards, computation..? I think each one of these has its own problem and only "the big names" give you wider chances.
   2. is the final delivery part of the interface? I explain: some clients may start "wanting design and delivery in bim" (which says nothing): Is there any field experience to say what kind of output is required?
2. Italian software si/no: stop the problems of data exchange seen before:
   1. How much less cost, in money, to purchase?
   2. How much more can they give as a response to Italian procedures/norms? (maybe if they have some history, you will soon see how they behaved in the previous years)

Can anyone help?
I write because they're the same problems we have in infrastructure, with the difference that there are four cats and the client is just public administration (I said everything, in good and bad... )

 

[x11start]

I have never intervened in this section of the forum, but I allow myself to give only 2 ideas.... practically to the antipods:

harpaceas tekla a software decidedly interesting and intuitive (they are also the owners of sketchups), from the cost not properly to the reach of all the pockets and with a "personalization" (but this depends on the sector in which you work) that requires many contacts (for a fee) with the dealer for Italy.... but the result is guaranteed, if you don't get tired of paying. . .

to the antipods we have freecad... that as the name says is free, but it requires a far more "flat" learning curve, it is still a bit uncertain, so lack of comfort that the paid ones have for years, you can completely customize; but you need to learn python.

.... personally I am devouring tutorials of the second!

 

[gibi]

Hello x11start,

I too, as a designer, thought about the bim on the part of the creation of the model (and I thank you for the suggestions that I will go to deepen), but I recently started a " panoramic tour" on the dark side of the bim, at least for me.
for work needs I tried to figure out what you do with the model after you created it, that is the final customer and who, in a nutshell, is not a designer but only a user.

Well, I realized there's a world of software and really different needs from ours.
where maybe there's even more chance of growth.

you switch from software for model consistency, visualization and analysis (also to make various 4d, 5d) and built asset management.
in these areas, the first thing I understand is that it serves a much more slender model than what we manipulate in the construction phase ("authoring" for benparlanti...).

I'm still studying

 

[x11start]

definitely the bim represents the future: it is a bit like the passage that was from the tecnigraph to the cad.... However, I believe that ideas are not yet many that can say that they are clear (!), even among those who market bim products.
the prefabrication sector in ca, in which I operate, the bim would like to assemble all the elements of a shed, adopting its own caskets (and this means a heavy customization!) and have in a few clicks, the price, the concrete mc, the kg of iron, the design of all the tables of the elements. . .
that I know there are no prefabricators that have succeeded to perfection... even if a study I know, he did as a peoprious leader with the harpaces tekla becoming a reference point.
However at this point, those who want to achieve the same results... must necessarily change their way of working and maybe even their own cashiers... or would be forced to leave even more from zero.
other sectors are more "standard": civil construction e.g. and that is why products (more or less valid) are proliferated to realize in a few minutes a roof or a staircase.

 

[gibi]

If you're in building prefabrication, it's one of the most suitable areas.
tekla, I don't use it because it's out of my field (although there's a "civil"...), but I know it's a developed sw where (I don't remember if it's a sw or a Norwegian) this process is already far ahead.
The real problem is that he talked about it (too much) without really doing it.

 

[x11start]

I agree with the fact that you have heard more words (and money) than not concrete facts (from English "concrete" -> "cement" ehehehe!).
As I said earlier, the underlying problem is that it is necessary to adapt the methods of production (and this could also be done even if with not a few efforts!), but above all to change the crates (i.e. the molds used for the elements).... and this is impractical.... because it would be necessary to throw all the equipment purchased in years.
vice versa adapting software to existing equipment, means starting from zero (or almost) with customizations... to reach a result that is not optimized.
all start from this second hypothesis and then see that the costs of counseling rise to dismeasure, without having substantial benefits.... and quit everything!
That is why in my opinion, returning to my first intervention in this post, freecad is not a solution to be discarded a priori!
in this case you have to take into account a lot of extra hours to learn how to use it well and then, just at a time start to understand the things that you can improve.... but one at a time. with patience!
I until now did this with autocad and autolisp.